Dear David I have noticed that you have made lots of assumtions rather than actually quoting fact or perhaps asking me for those facts. Either way, my venue is doing reasonably well with approximately 40-50 people on a tuesday night attending. That seems to be more than double that of of our nearest competitor, which has been operating for some time. The people attending my venue have been attracted through a range of advertising and marketing strategies that I have developed. I am not a "newbie" to business and have run a number of succesful businesses in the past. THIS Karaoke business is a relatively new venture, and as with any new venue, time is needed to establish a succesfull operation. You asked me - How do you measure your patrons' attendance, and what form of contact have you established with them between gigs (eg: email)? I measure it in a number of ways but obviously "bums on Seats" is a good indicator though turnover in areas such as food service, bar and gambling are crucial to the nights success. I have created a FREE loyalty and rewards program for regular visitors and make regular contact through a monthly newletter to them. - How many singers do you have, how many can you cater for, and how many non-singers does each singer bring on average? The singer non singer ratio would be about 50/50 and I hope it stays at least at that point. Non singers are as important to me as singers and they are rewarded with prizes and incentives as are singers. - How do you attract local singers and non-singers (eg: outdoor banners, posters, flyers, telepathy?) We have banners outside , posters inside and local newspaper averts from last week. - How do you measure your success, and what are the figures for failure or success? Exceeding the venue owners expectations will ensure longevity. I charge a figure much higher than the amount you talk of and hope to increase that figure in line with growing numbers at the venue. You seem to have missed the whole point of my email and gone into defence of your decision process with W2S, no matter how ill conceived. I cannot understand how you come to the conclusion that 30 people in a venue equals $30,000 for a $60 subcription. I have no illusions that your site would come close to bringing anywhere near that amount of return. My email was about suggesting that people like myself would be willing to pay MORE for an advertising subscription to a site that would reach more people. Possibly giving YOU the same financial return that you receive now and NOT charging the general karaoke public for it. We (you) are currently asking singers to pay for the privilige of reading our advertising and coming to our money making venues. It seems as though you think that the listings on W2S are not "advertising"!!!! Of course they are advertising, just like posters, banners, direct marketing, leaflets, newspaper and radio. I was hoping that you could see that but secretly expected the reponse that i got. At this stage I probably won't renew my sub when it is due as I don't find much of the content relevant to me, not to say that it doesn't appeal to many others. As I have stated before, as a singer I will not pay to read advertising or make comments on an internet forum. As a host I think that there could be enormous value in a site that is open to all people, creating the opportunity for people who are NOT karaoke diehards, to become part of the karaoke community more easily. Regards

REPLY from David
I'm unsure from your response whether you are really seeking some information or advice, or whether you're just unhappy about paying for information. As regards your venue, 40-50 people on a Tuesday seems good to me, whilst 50/50 singers -v- non-singers suggests to me that the work needed is in using your present singers to bring more watchers/friends/family. I have been to a lot of venues, and, because I review them from a business perspective, and because I hear a lot of what goes on behind the scenes, I can offer a fair bit of advice. You are keen to impress upon me your business expertise, so forgive me if you have considered the following for increasing your crowd: 1. Venue layout: Does it enourage a good singer-to-friend ratio by providing bigger tables for groups near the action, and singles/couples tables further away? Are there promotions in place that rewards parties and groups? Is the karaoke set up and run in a way that makes singers want to drag along non-singing friends to impress? Is this 'karaoke' or a 'karaoke show'? If e show cannot be easily seen from outside, is there a camera running on the show with a screen displaying it for passers-by and those in other bars? 2. Karaoke show format: Is the karaoke driven from the perspective of the non-singer rather than the singer - in other words, is it a place where there is more incentive to stay and watch than to stay and sing? You already have sufficient singers to be able to lose a few in favour of new non-singers, so have you turned the emphasis squarely towards the audience? Could you utilise a system that involves non-singers, such as their pinning requests to a board to which singers come and select requested songs? 3. Advertising: Is this angled towards singers (you see to have enough already), or does this target non-singers who are seeking some local and free entertainment? What is the main message that your advertising is saying, who is your target market, and how are you going about getting your message directly to them? Other questions I have would be able whether you're keeping a static crowd that attends every week, and could use some ideas that have worked for other hosts in bringing new faces, or whether your crowd changes each week and you could use some ideas from other shows that bring people back every week? However, I'm unsure whether you wish to discuss and of this. I'd also be interested to hear the details of your 'FREE loyalty and rewards program for regular visitors', the prizes with which your non-singers are rewarded, what is actually written on your outside banner (perhaps you have a photo of it?) and on your newspaper and leaflet advertising. As regards W2S, the listings may have the effect of advertising, but the site is constructed in a way that fits with information listings. I don't believe that advertising would have the same credibility as the present system, and indeed the old website tended more to advertising, and that was one reason for the structured approach to the present website system. You comment about advertising -v- information makes me wonder whether your banners/newspaper ads/leaflets are actually information or advertising. I'm surprised that you claim not to find the content of a karaoke website relevent to you as a karaoke host - but do let me know what sort of content you would like to see, and I'll have a shot at angling the website in that direction.
Submitted by *** on 21-07-2006

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